New Top 10

[jdeep]

So what is everyone's rankings now that we are almost through a 1/3 of the year? The bigger question is: where should PA be ranked? I am definitely more out of the kickball loop than before, but is PA playing again? At one point should they start to be bumped from the consistent #2 ranking? I know in 2011 they proved they were clearly one of the top 2 teams, but have teams caught up to them at all? The last two tournaments they played in did not go so well. There is really no way to know until they play.

My top 10 is based on results from all of 2012, not just the last tourney. The list considers potential, consistency and at least to some extent, results from 2011. I know people will disagree with this list - but here it goes.

1. Meatballs
2. JKID
3. NYSH
4. OSC
5. Panik Attack (assuming they play again)
6. LIU
7. MMS/GOMK merger
8. Flying V
9. Fully Loaded
10(a). Cobra Kai
10(b) Sofa

[krabbas]

Q: Why JKID over NYSH?

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

I think the top 5 teams you have are right but not sure about the order because Panik is questionable.

nysh- took a year to gel with some bad days but they are clearly on the right track. CC final , being knocked out by a good Osc team in sfko and winning Austin. Its gonna be fun tracking this teams summer to see if they can keep up what they have been doing. Could be a 2-3 tournament win season for them.

Jkid- 2 tournaments in and lost in both to the team that won the event. Tons of experiance on this squad. Already considered a top 3 team in the circuit this team is going to get better. They want to be #1 and have the players to make a run at events.

Panik- based on last year I still think this team is better than the 2 listed above. Panik make less mistakes and is one of the best line drive kicking teams in the game. They can score with 2 outs on them and thats one reason they have always been a step ahead of the rest. Not sure what their plans are for this year but im sure we will now by the atl,vbko dc swing of summer.

Osc- tough team but they are lacking something. I dont know what that something is yet but i know they dont have it. Can beat any of the teams listed above but can also be beat by them



if these teams all played 5 games vs each other id say it go:

Nysh-3 Osc 2
Nysh 1 Panik 4
Nysh 2 Jki 3

Jki 2 panik 3
jki 3 nysh 2
jki 3 osc 2

osc 1 panik 4
osc 2 jki 3
osc2 nysh 3

[Catch-22]

So what is everyone's rankings now that we are almost through a 1/3 of the year? The bigger question is: where should PA be ranked? I am definitely more out of the kickball loop than before, but is PA playing again? At one point should they start to be bumped from the consistent #2 ranking? I know in 2011 they proved they were clearly one of the top 2 teams, but have teams caught up to them at all? The last two tournaments they played in did not go so well. There is really no way to know until they play.

My top 10 is based on results from all of 2012, not just the last tourney. The list considers potential, consistency and at least to some extent, results from 2011. I know people will disagree with this list - but here it goes.

1. Meatballs
2. JKID
3. NYSH
4. OSC
5. Panik Attack (assuming they play again)
6. LIU
7. MMS/GOMK merger
8. Flying V
9. Fully Loaded
10(a). Cobra Kai
10(b) Sofa

That's kind of a weird list. NYSH just beat JKID at Austin and OSC just beat NYSH at SFKO. Are results not really being taken into consideration?

[Kickbot]

I don't think you can rank Panik Attack for 2012 until they play in a tournament and we see how the layoff has affected them.

For reference, our record against the top teams:
v. Meatballs 0-1
v. Panik 2-1
v. OSC 2-2
v. JKI 1-0

[Catch-22]

I think the top 5 teams you have are right but not sure about the order because Panik is questionable.

nysh- took a year to gel with some bad days but they are clearly on the right track. CC final , being knocked out by a good Osc team in sfko and winning Austin. Its gonna be fun tracking this teams summer to see if they can keep up what they have been doing. Could be a 2-3 tournament win season for them.

Jkid- 2 tournaments in and lost in both to the team that won the event. Tons of experiance on this squad. Already considered a top 3 team in the circuit this team is going to get better. They want to be #1 and have the players to make a run at events.

Panik- based on last year I still think this team is better than the 2 listed above. Panik make less mistakes and is one of the best line drive kicking teams in the game. They can score with 2 outs on them and thats one reason they have always been a step ahead of the rest. Not sure what their plans are for this year but im sure we will now by the atl,vbko dc swing of summer.

Osc- tough team but they are lacking something. I dont know what that something is yet but i know they dont have it. Can beat any of the teams listed above but can also be beat by them



if these teams all played 5 games vs each other id say it go:

Nysh-3 Osc 2
Nysh 1 Panik 4
Nysh 2 Jki 3

Jki 2 panik 3
jki 3 nysh 2
jki 3 osc 2

osc 1 panik 4
osc 2 jki 3
osc2 nysh 3

How many years are we going to do this where teams are unimpressed with the out-of-season, out-of-shape DC team at SFKO and then we "shock" everyone with a strong second half? Is it 3 years now? OSC won't have a losing record to anyone by the end of the year.

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

Defense
1jki
2osc
3nysh

overall offense
1 osc
2 nysh
3 jki

kicking
1 osc
2 jki
3 nysh

bunting
1 osc
2 nysh
3 jki


This is just my opinion. Reason i think Jki is tough is cause the D. In their loss at sfko they had 5/6 innings that they allowed 0. And i take it 5/6 against Nysh in austin. They are not gonna put big #s on th board but i would be very surprised if they gave up more than 3 runs in a game against Osc or Nysh.

[Typod]

Despite being handicapped by being born in California, Los Brew Crew would beat a couple teams on here consistently, and give some more a very very tough time.

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

I think the top 5 teams you have are right but not sure about the order because Panik is questionable.

nysh- took a year to gel with some bad days but they are clearly on the right track. CC final , being knocked out by a good Osc team in sfko and winning Austin. Its gonna be fun tracking this teams summer to see if they can keep up what they have been doing. Could be a 2-3 tournament win season for them.

Jkid- 2 tournaments in and lost in both to the team that won the event. Tons of experiance on this squad. Already considered a top 3 team in the circuit this team is going to get better. They want to be #1 and have the players to make a run at events.

Panik- based on last year I still think this team is better than the 2 listed above. Panik make less mistakes and is one of the best line drive kicking teams in the game. They can score with 2 outs on them and thats one reason they have always been a step ahead of the rest. Not sure what their plans are for this year but im sure we will now by the atl,vbko dc swing of summer.

Osc- tough team but they are lacking something. I dont know what that something is yet but i know they dont have it. Can beat any of the teams listed above but can also be beat by them



if these teams all played 5 games vs each other id say it go:

Nysh-3 Osc 2
Nysh 1 Panik 4
Nysh 2 Jki 3

Jki 2 panik 3
jki 3 nysh 2
jki 3 osc 2

osc 1 panik 4
osc 2 jki 3
osc2 nysh 3

How many years are we going to do this where teams are unimpressed with the out-of-season, out-of-shape DC team at SFKO and then we "shock" everyone with a strong second half? Is it 3 years now? OSC won't have a losing record to anyone by the end of the year.

blowing that game in the NYC finals was not shocking.

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

Despite being handicapped by being born in California, Los Brew Crew would beat a couple teams on here consistently, and give some more a very very tough time.

If its the same team from CC then i would agree they can beat the 6-10 on jdeep's list but not a 1-5

[Hollywood B]

Despite being handicapped by being born in California, Los Brew Crew would beat a couple teams on here consistently, and give some more a very very tough time.

Will Los Brew Crew play in any non-California events? And isn't their best player also on Sofa King?

[jdeep]

Rankings are clearly subjective, and I know my list will differ from others. There is always a question of how to rank teams - past performance? head to head? who "would" win head to head if played on a neutral field with full squads? With my rankings, I tried to combine as many factors as possible.

NYSH v. JKID is obviously one where people will disagree. NYSH just beat JKID. Balls Deep beat the Meatballs in ultra one season. Does that mean I thought BD was better team? No. And imo, I still give the edge to JKID in this matchup. I don't know who NYSH was missing in Austin. I know JKID was missing 3 of their top bunters (Dan, Mccain and Keith) and many others. I know that game could have gone either way (in fact we were about 2 inches from having runners on 1st and 2nd with no outs in the 5th inning with Keith coming up). I am not down playing NYSH at all - they played a great game and a great tournament. They were the best team that day and deserved to win. But kickball is a game where two teams can meet 6 games and rotate winning each game. And combining results from South Florida and Austin, along witih potential, I give the edge to JKID.

[Catch-22]

I think the top 5 teams you have are right but not sure about the order because Panik is questionable.

nysh- took a year to gel with some bad days but they are clearly on the right track. CC final , being knocked out by a good Osc team in sfko and winning Austin. Its gonna be fun tracking this teams summer to see if they can keep up what they have been doing. Could be a 2-3 tournament win season for them.

Jkid- 2 tournaments in and lost in both to the team that won the event. Tons of experiance on this squad. Already considered a top 3 team in the circuit this team is going to get better. They want to be #1 and have the players to make a run at events.

Panik- based on last year I still think this team is better than the 2 listed above. Panik make less mistakes and is one of the best line drive kicking teams in the game. They can score with 2 outs on them and thats one reason they have always been a step ahead of the rest. Not sure what their plans are for this year but im sure we will now by the atl,vbko dc swing of summer.

Osc- tough team but they are lacking something. I dont know what that something is yet but i know they dont have it. Can beat any of the teams listed above but can also be beat by them



if these teams all played 5 games vs each other id say it go:

Nysh-3 Osc 2
Nysh 1 Panik 4
Nysh 2 Jki 3

Jki 2 panik 3
jki 3 nysh 2
jki 3 osc 2

osc 1 panik 4
osc 2 jki 3
osc2 nysh 3

How many years are we going to do this where teams are unimpressed with the out-of-season, out-of-shape DC team at SFKO and then we "shock" everyone with a strong second half? Is it 3 years now? OSC won't have a losing record to anyone by the end of the year.

blowing that game in the NYC finals was not shocking.

Definitely not, especially considering half our current team wasn't playing for OSC at that point.

[Typod]

Despite being handicapped by being born in California, Los Brew Crew would beat a couple teams on here consistently, and give some more a very very tough time.

If its the same team from CC then i would agree they can beat the 6-10 on jdeep's list but not a 1-5

Fair assessment.

But they didn't go to CC, just FC (Im assuming thats what you meant)

[Typod]

Despite being handicapped by being born in California, Los Brew Crew would beat a couple teams on here consistently, and give some more a very very tough time.

Will Los Brew Crew play in any non-California events? And isn't their best player also on Sofa King?

Can't speak for them as far as traveling. If we're looking at teams picking up guys for tourneys Flying V should be also looked at.

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

Nysh ,Jki and osc are all #2

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

Despite being handicapped by being born in California, Los Brew Crew would beat a couple teams on here consistently, and give some more a very very tough time.

If its the same team from CC then i would agree they can beat the 6-10 on jdeep's list but not a 1-5

Fair assessment.

But they didn't go to CC, just FC (Im assuming thats what you meant)

my fault. was thinking of foster kids(i think)

[Catch-22]

Rankings are clearly subjective, and I know my list will differ from others. There is always a question of how to rank teams - past performance? head to head? who "would" win head to head if played on a neutral field with full squads? With my rankings, I tried to combine as many factors as possible.

NYSH v. JKID is obviously one where people will disagree. NYSH just beat JKID. Balls Deep beat the Meatballs in ultra one season. Does that mean I thought BD was better team? No. And imo, I still give the edge to JKID in this matchup. I don't know who NYSH was missing in Austin. I know JKID was missing 3 of their top bunters (Dan, Mccain and Keith) and many others. I know that game could have gone either way (in fact we were about 2 inches from having runners on 1st and 2nd with no outs in the 5th inning with Keith coming up). I am not down playing NYSH at all - they played a great game and a great tournament. They were the best team that day and deserved to win. But kickball is a game where two teams can meet 6 games and rotate winning each game. And combining results from South Florida and Austin, along witih potential, I give the edge to JKID.

I get what you're saying. I'm a big proponent of not only considering teams' results, but also taking into account teams' expected outcomes and potential as well. That's why in any post LSKO ranking, I'd still have JKID ahead of Cobra Kai. But at the same time, you don't want to swing so far in the other direction that you don't give results at least some weight. I usually draw the line at head-to-head elimination games in a team's most recent tourney. If that happened, I give the nod to whoever came out on top. I get both teams were missing people in Austin and it was a close game, but it was neutral ground and NYSH came out on top. I don't see how NYSH can be ranked behind JKID right now.

[Hollywood B]

Despite being handicapped by being born in California, Los Brew Crew would beat a couple teams on here consistently, and give some more a very very tough time.

Will Los Brew Crew play in any non-California events? And isn't their best player also on Sofa King?

Can't speak for them as far as traveling. If we're looking at teams picking up guys for tourneys Flying V should be also looked at.

Just trying to gauge the strength of each team on their own. If that guy is traveling with Sofa, I would rank Sofa a little higher and have LBC much lower. Seemed like a big impact player from the video I saw, and I wouldn't rank both teams assuming he is on both.

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

I think the top 5 teams you have are right but not sure about the order because Panik is questionable.

nysh- took a year to gel with some bad days but they are clearly on the right track. CC final , being knocked out by a good Osc team in sfko and winning Austin. Its gonna be fun tracking this teams summer to see if they can keep up what they have been doing. Could be a 2-3 tournament win season for them.

Jkid- 2 tournaments in and lost in both to the team that won the event. Tons of experiance on this squad. Already considered a top 3 team in the circuit this team is going to get better. They want to be #1 and have the players to make a run at events.

Panik- based on last year I still think this team is better than the 2 listed above. Panik make less mistakes and is one of the best line drive kicking teams in the game. They can score with 2 outs on them and thats one reason they have always been a step ahead of the rest. Not sure what their plans are for this year but im sure we will now by the atl,vbko dc swing of summer.

Osc- tough team but they are lacking something. I dont know what that something is yet but i know they dont have it. Can beat any of the teams listed above but can also be beat by them



if these teams all played 5 games vs each other id say it go:

Nysh-3 Osc 2
Nysh 1 Panik 4
Nysh 2 Jki 3

Jki 2 panik 3
jki 3 nysh 2
jki 3 osc 2

osc 1 panik 4
osc 2 jki 3
osc2 nysh 3

How many years are we going to do this where teams are unimpressed with the out-of-season, out-of-shape DC team at SFKO and then we "shock" everyone with a strong second half? Is it 3 years now? OSC won't have a losing record to anyone by the end of the year.

blowing that game in the NYC finals was not shocking.

Definitely not, especially considering half our current team wasn't playing for OSC at that point.

Its always tough to talk about dc kickball cause i think of ib,osc,m2s and the others as all the same team

[Catch-22]

Nysh ,Jki and osc are all #2

The New York teams and OSC will have the chance to sort things out in Harrisburg soon enough.

[Catch-22]

Its always tough to talk about dc kickball cause i think of ib,osc,m2s and the others as all the same team

That's why we merged. Figured it'd make things easier. For once, we actually all are on the same team.

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

Nysh ,Jki and osc are all #2

The New York teams and OSC will have the chance to sort things out in Harrisburg soon enough.

pre sfko i felt the best teams would be jki,osc and nysh in that order. Knowing things are gonna shuffle. Osc being off the radar for now leave the question of who is 2? I would not be surprised if all 3 of these teams won events this year.

what are these 3 teams event schedule from now-CC?

[Catch-22]

Nysh ,Jki and osc are all #2

The New York teams and OSC will have the chance to sort things out in Harrisburg soon enough.

pre sfko i felt the best teams would be jki,osc and nysh in that order. Knowing things are gonna shuffle. Osc being off the radar for now leave the question of who is 2? I would not be surprised if all 3 of these teams won events this year.

what are these 3 teams event schedule from now-CC?

Probably Harrisburg, DC, NYC, FC, CC for sure

Maybe a couple others depending on people's schedules

What is Meatballs' schedule looking like?

[jdeep]

Rankings are clearly subjective, and I know my list will differ from others. There is always a question of how to rank teams - past performance? head to head? who "would" win head to head if played on a neutral field with full squads? With my rankings, I tried to combine as many factors as possible.

NYSH v. JKID is obviously one where people will disagree. NYSH just beat JKID. Balls Deep beat the Meatballs in ultra one season. Does that mean I thought BD was better team? No. And imo, I still give the edge to JKID in this matchup. I don't know who NYSH was missing in Austin. I know JKID was missing 3 of their top bunters (Dan, Mccain and Keith) and many others. I know that game could have gone either way (in fact we were about 2 inches from having runners on 1st and 2nd with no outs in the 5th inning with Keith coming up). I am not down playing NYSH at all - they played a great game and a great tournament. They were the best team that day and deserved to win. But kickball is a game where two teams can meet 6 games and rotate winning each game. And combining results from South Florida and Austin, along witih potential, I give the edge to JKID.

I get what you're saying. I'm a big proponent of not only considering teams' results, but also taking into account teams' expected outcomes and potential as well. That's why in any post LSKO ranking, I'd still have JKID ahead of Cobra Kai. But at the same time, you don't want to swing so far in the other direction that you don't give results at least some weight. I usually draw the line at head-to-head elimination games in a team's most recent tourney. If that happened, I give the nod to whoever came out on top. I get both teams were missing people in Austin and it was a close game, but it was neutral ground and NYSH came out on top. I don't see how NYSH can be ranked behind JKID right now.

I do not disagree with your reasoning as to why you would rank the teams that way. That is fair. I will stick with my rankings.

On a side note, I certainly do not want to make this about excuses in that game, b/c again NYSH deserved to win. But wind and field conditions were HUGE in austin (more so than I have ever seen). Wind was very strong and there were tons of bumps that affected pitching and kicking tremendously. NYSH played on the same field the entire day (i think this was addressed in another thread) - that gave them a slight advantage over everyone they played. The field conditions DID NOT affect my rankings, as I am not making excuses. I just think its interesting that it is possible to still have a field advantage in a neutral location.

JKID's schedule: I believe Jax, Atlanta and New Orleans. Not sure if there will be another tourney in there or not.

[Jersey3bFP]

For someone who isn't making excuses you sure find a way to throw them into every reply you post on here.
NYSH will prob be at Harrisburg, DC, NYC, Boston, CC.

[MEATBALLKEVIN]

Jki will win either Jax or Atl.

Osc will not win Dc cause we are going to 3peat there. Maybe Harrisburg? And Nysh will win Boston for sure.

[McCoy]

PA has only missed one tournament this year that we would have gone to. Most teams have only played one more tournament than us. We will be back and probably play just as many events, if not more, than most circuit teams. Rank us where ya like. It's been a while since we had much to gain from a "W".

[Jersey3bFP]

PA has only missed one tournament this year that we would have gone to. Most teams have only played one more tournament than us. We will be back and probably play just as many events, if not more, than most circuit teams. Rank us where ya like. It's been a while since we had much to gain from a "W".

Glad to see you guys coming back McCoy, hope the foot is all healed up. What will be your first tournament?

[Catch-22]

Jki will win either Jax or Atl.

Osc will not win Dc cause we are going to 3peat there. Maybe Harrisburg? And Nysh will win Boston for sure.

Lost the last two finals to you in DC. Three's a charm as they say.

[Typod]

Just trying to gauge the strength of each team on their own. If that guy is traveling with Sofa, I would rank Sofa a little higher and have LBC much lower. Seemed like a big impact player from the video I saw, and I wouldn't rank both teams assuming he is on both.

Gotcha. The guy is a game changer for sure. I really dont know what the plan is for him or LBC going forward in regards t the circuit. Founders Cup better watch out though.

[McCoy]

PA has only missed one tournament this year that we would have gone to. Most teams have only played one more tournament than us. We will be back and probably play just as many events, if not more, than most circuit teams. Rank us where ya like. It's been a while since we had much to gain from a "W".

Glad to see you guys coming back McCoy, hope the foot is all healed up. What will be your first tournament?

We are in negotiations with Circuit Event Manager's for Appearance Fees. Stay tuned. In all seriousness...we will have a team in Atlanta. I am not supposed to be cleared to run until after June 28th(I'm aiming to beat that)...so my participation is up in the air...I will be down there regardless.

[jdeep]

For someone who isn't making excuses you sure find a way to throw them into every reply you post on here.
NYSH will prob be at Harrisburg, DC, NYC, Boston, CC.

Where? I do not think the field conditions affected the outcome of our game. I mentioned we were missing players - but that had to do with my rankings, not with our game. I know NYSH was missing players too.

[JellyDogg]

There is a reasonable justification for any permutation of NYSH, JKID, OSC, and Panik for #2-5. There will probably be much more clarity after PKO/GKO.

[Jersey3bFP]

For someone who isn't making excuses you sure find a way to throw them into every reply you post on here.
NYSH will prob be at Harrisburg, DC, NYC, Boston, CC.

Where? I do not think the field conditions affected the outcome of our game. I mentioned we were missing players - but that had to do with my rankings, not with our game. I know NYSH was missing players too.

On a side note, I certainly do not want to make this about excuses in that game, b/c again NYSH deserved to win. But wind and field conditions were HUGE in austin (more so than I have ever seen). Wind was very strong and there were tons of bumps that affected pitching and kicking tremendously. NYSH played on the same field the entire day (i think this was addressed in another thread) - that gave them a slight advantage over everyone they played.

Im pretty sure everyone can read between the lines here. Anytime someone says they don't want to make excuses and follows it up with a BUT, seems to be pointing to the contrary. Just make a point and stick to it, no need to justify something in your next sentence.

[kwido03]

For someone who isn't making excuses you sure find a way to throw them into every reply you post on here.
NYSH will prob be at Harrisburg, DC, NYC, Boston, CC.

Where? I do not think the field conditions affected the outcome of our game. I mentioned we were missing players - but that had to do with my rankings, not with our game. I know NYSH was missing players too.[/quote

Jersey- How can we analyze and talk about the game/tourney so that you don't cry excuse after everything said? You won and were the better team that day. You earned this home field advantage because you are the 1 seed and that is how tourneys are run I guess but it was a factor. There are a lot of factors that affect a game besides the throws and catches. Does it all have to be excuses or is it possible that people just want to talk about the real factors that affected the day so we can analyze the results. Fully Loaded has like 50 + runs due to the wind while others played completely opposite fields where that wasnt remotely possible. In a tourney where runs against is a big factor, the fields and location can be a real difference. These are not excuses and IMO the top seed should not get added advantages. That includes JKI. Yeah it helped us to stay put, but I don't see why a top seed should get that added bonus just to save moving a tent. This is not why we lost but this was a factor in the game. This was a huge factor in the tournament and for many teams if you just look at the stats. Some teams were able to stay and learn the bounces, pitching, and kicking on a specific field while others had to roam. Why give teams this advantage?

[dp3]

Yes, the "I don't want to make excuses, BUT blah blah blah...I'm not making excuses though! So-and-so earned it!" is something I've noticed on these boards quite a bit. It's just like starting a statement with "No offense..."...some shitty half-veiled insult is sure to follow 100% of the time.


"Not to take anything away from team/player, but <TAKE AWAY FROM TEAM/PLAYER>."

[jdeep]

Most of the time I agree - starting with "i dont want to make excuses", etc. etc. is really making an excuse. But in this case, I am analyzing two separate things. (1) the game b/w NYSH and JKID; and (2) my rankings. I am not making excuses for the loss. I am analyzing all factors when considering who I think it slightly better and the reasons for it.

[Jersey3bFP]

Kwido:

You can analyze/talk about the stats of the game all you want, Im not the one crying on the boards here. I have nothing to cry about nor would I ever after a tournament. "Oh the wind, the field, we were missing players," just man up and accept defeat. If you'll take a second and actually re-read the posts you'll see that I have not complained once, just pointing out the obvious. You guys played tough, we had a hard fought battle, end of story. You're just proving my point more with these wordy responses.

[The Paddy]

I don't want to make excuses for my sub-par gameplay on Saturday, but...It wasn't my fault! Honest... I ran out of gas. I... I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from out of town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake. A terrible flood. Locusts! IT WASN'T MY FAULT, I SWEAR TO GOD!